Firmilian of Caesarea/TITLE> <META CONTENT="text/html; charset=windows-1252" HTTP-EQUIV="Content-Type"> <META CONTENT="MSHTML 5.00.2314.1000" NAME="GENERATOR"> <SCRIPT TYPE="text/javascript"> var _gaq = _gaq || []; _gaq.push(['_setAccount', 'UA-20465777-1']); _gaq.push(['_trackPageview']); (function() { var ga = document.createElement('script'); ga.type = 'text/javascript'; ga.async = true; ga.src = ('https:' == document.location.protocol ? 'https://ssl' : 'http://www') + '.google-analytics.com/ga.js'; var s = document.getElementsByTagName('script')[0]; s.parentNode.insertBefore(ga, s); })(); </SCRIPT> </HEAD> <BODY> <div class="main_wrap"> <div class="grid_table"> <!-- start INSERT --> <P><IMG SRC="emblemtr.gif" ALT="About valid Tradition" ALIGN="LEFT" WIDTH="180" HEIGHT="180" BORDER="0" USEMAP="#maptrad"></P> <MAP NAME="maptrad"> <!--Sciptural Tradition--> <AREA SHAPE="POLY" COORDS="2,17,3,168,58,114,59,55,2,19,11,29,12,29,2,17" HREF="biblical.asp" ALT="Scriptural Tradition"> <!--Latent Tradition--> <AREA SHAPE="POLY" COORDS="61,122,27,177,173,175,124,122,60,123,63,122,63,125,61,122" HREF="latent.asp" ALT="Latent Tradition"> <!--Dynamic Tradition--> <AREA SHAPE="POLY" COORDS="176,32,128,59,128,119,177,155,177,31,175,31,167,39,176,32" HREF="dynamic.asp" ALT="Dynamic Tradition"> <!--Informed Tradition--> <AREA SHAPE="POLY" COORDS="36,2,67,55,126,55,155,1,36,4,38,5,39,6,36,2" HREF="informed.asp" ALT="Informed Tradition"> <!--Valid Tradition--> <AREA SHAPE="RECT" COORDS="63,56,126,119" HREF="valid.asp" ALT="Valid Tradition"> </MAP><!-- start body --> <H1 ALIGN="CENTER">Firmilian of Caesarea</H1> <H4 ALIGN="CENTER">Letter of Firmilian, Bishop of Caesarea, to Cyprian, Bishop of Carthage, 200- 258 AD.</H4> <P>"Suddenly, a certain woman started up in our midst: she presented herself as a prophetess, being in a state of ecstasy and acting as if she were filled with the Holy Spirit. But she was so deeply under the sway of the principal demons that she managed to disturb and deceive the brethren for a long time by performing astonishing and preternatural feats...And the woman, through the illusions and trickeries of the devil, had devised a number of ways for deceiving the faithful. Among other practices by which she deceived many, she frequently dared even to use this one: employing a by no means despicable form of invocation, she would pretend to sanctify the bread and celebrate the Eucharist, and she would offer the sacrifice to the Lord not without the sacred recitation of the wonted formula. And she would baptize many also, adopting the customary and legitimate wording of the baptismal interrogation. And all this she did in such a way that she appeared to deviate in no particular from ecclesiastical discipline. What, then, are we to say about such a baptism, where an evil demon baptized through the agency of a woman? Can it be that Stephen and his adherents extend their approval even to this baptism, especially as it came complete with Trinitarian credal formula and the legitimate invocation of the Church? Is it credible that forgiveness of sins was granted or that the rebirth of the saving waters was duly accomplished in a case where everything may have been done in semblance of the truth but was in fact done though (sic) the agency of the demon?"</P> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P><B><FONT COLOR="000000" SIZE="3" FACE="Times New Roman"> Firmilian of Caesarea, in Saint Cyprian, <I>Epist., </I>75: <I>CSEL </I>3, pp. 817-818.</FONT></B></P> </BLOCKQUOTE> <BLOCKQUOTE> <P> <U>Note</U>. John H.Wright makes this comment: "It should be noted that the heart of Firmilian's objection is that the person baptizing is the instrument of a demon, not that she is a woman. Even a man baptizing under similar circumstances would be baptizing invalidly in Firmilian's view. The same thing should be said about the performance of the eucharistic rite: the person presuming to do this acts "through the illusions and trickeries of the devil." That she is a woman may aggravate the matter in Firmilian's view, but it is not the point of his objection. It cannot in context be taken as an argument against the possibility of ordaining women. (p. 519). From: John H. Wright. "Patristic Testimony of Women's Ordination in INTER INSIGNIORES." <I>Theological Studies</I> 58 (1997), pp. 516-526.</P> </BLOCKQUOTE> <BR><BR> <CENTER><a href="http://twitter.com/JohnWijngaards" class="twitter-follow-button">Follow @JohnWijngaards</a> <script src="http://platform.twitter.com/widgets.js" type="text/javascript"></script> </CENTER> <P ALIGN="RIGHT"><B><FONT COLOR="#804040">Please, credit this document<BR> as published by www.womenpriests.org!</FONT></B></P> <!-- end INSERT --> <style type="text/css"> <!-- .style1 {color: #FFFFFF} .style2 {color: #FFFF00} --> </style> <FORM><INPUT Type="button" VALUE="Back" onClick="history.go(-1);return true;"></FORM> <hr /> <table align="center" width="80%" border="0" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="5"> <tr> <td align="center"><h3 align="center"><strong>This website is maintained by the <a href="http://www.wijngaardsinstitute.com/">Wijngaards Institute for Catholic Research.</a></strong></h3> <p align="center">The Institute is known for issuing <strong><a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wijngaards_Institute_for_Catholic_Research">academic reports and statements on relevant issues in the Church.</a></strong></p> </td> </tr> </table> <TABLE width="90%" align="center" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="5"> <TR> <TD WIDTH="200"><a href="https://www.wijngaardsinstitute.com/make-a-donation/"><img src="http://www.womenpriests.org/images3/hans5.gif" width="184" height="308" alt="Wijngaards Institute for Catholic Research" /></a></TD> <TD valign="top" align="left"><h4 align="center">Dear visitor, you are welcome to use our material. However: building up and maintaining this site costs money. We are a Charity and work mainly with volunteers, but find it difficult to pay our overheads. Please, <a href="https://www.wijngaardsinstitute.com/make-a-donation/">become a Friend or support us with a donation</a>. Also, as some of you recommended to us, we are exploring how to generate income by advertising. Please, support us in this effort and <a href="http://www.womenpriests.org/contact.asp">send us your suggestions</a>. <br /><font color="#800000">John Wijngaards</font></h4></TD> <TD align="center" WIDTH="200"><p><a href="https://www.wijngaardsinstitute.com/make-a-donation/"><img src="http://www.womenpriests.org/images10/miriam3.jpg" width="190" height="269" alt="Wijngaards Institute for Catholic Research" longdesc="http://www.wijngaardsinstitute.org" /></a></p> <h4><font color="#800000">Miriam Duignan</font></h4></TD> </TR></TABLE> </BR> <table width="70%" border="0" align="center" cellpadding="0" cellspacing="2"> <tr> <th valign="top" scope="row"><table width="300" border="0" align="center" cellpadding="5" cellspacing="5" bgcolor="#008080"> <tr> <th align="center" scope="row"><form action="https://www.paypal.com/cgi-bin/webscr" method="post"> <div align="center"><span class="style1">Please, support our campaign<br> for women priests</span> <input type="hidden" name="cmd" value="_donations"> <input type="hidden" name="business" value="jos@womenpriests.org"> <input type="hidden" name="lc" value="GB"> <input type="hidden" name="item_name" value="donation"> <input type="hidden" name="item_number" value="1020"> </div> <table align="center" width="70" border="0" cellspacing="0" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <th scope="row"><select name="currency_code"> <option value="GBP">UK Pounds</option> <option value="EUR">Euros</option> <option value="USD">US dollars</option> <option value="AUD">OZ dollars</option> <option value="CAD">CAN dollars</option> </select></th> <th scope="row"><select name="amount"> <option value="10">10</option> <option value="15">15</option> <option value="25">25</option> <option value="40">40</option> <option value="60">60</option> <option value="100">100</option> <option value="200">200</option> </select></th> </tr> </table> <table align="center" width="50" border="0" cellspacing="5" cellpadding="0"> <tr> <th align="center" scope="row> <input type="hidden" name="bn" value="PP-DonationsBF:btn_donate_LG.gif:NonHostedGuest"> <input align="center" type="image" src="https://www.paypal.com/en_GB/i/btn/btn_donate_LG.gif" border="0" name="submit"></th> </tr> </table> </form></th> </tr> </table> <p>Visit our new websites:</p> <h4><a href="http://www.natural-law-and-conscience.org">Natural Law and Conscience</a></h4> <h4 align="center"><a href="http://www.familysynod2015.com">Synod on the Family 2015</a></h4> <h4><a href="http://www.catholicsandcontraception.com">Catholics and Contraception</a></h4> <td><table width="220" align="center" cellspacing="10"> <tr> <td><table width="220" border="1" align="center" cellpadding="1"> <tr> <td align="center"><link href="http://www.womenpriests.org/interact/send/NL-style.css" rel="stylesheet" type="text/css"> <div> <b class="spiffy"> <b class="spiffy1"></b> <b class="spiffy2"></b> <b class="spiffy3"></b> <b class="spiffy4"></b> <b class="spiffy5"></b></b> <div class="spiffyfg" align="center"> Join our Women Priests' Mailing List<br> for occasional newsletters: <form name="form1" method="post" action="http://www.womenpriests.org/interact/send/NL-process.php"> <table border="0" cellpadding="2" cellspacing="2"> <tr> <td><font size="-1">Email:</font></td> <td><input name="email" type="text"></td> </tr> <tr> <td><font size="-1">Name:</font></td> <td><input name="name" type="text" id="name"></td> </tr> <tr> <td><font size="-1">Surname:</font></td> <td><input name="surname" type="text" id="surname"></td> </tr> <tr> <td><font size="-1">City:</font></td> <td><input name="city" type="text" id="city"></td> </tr> <tr> <td><font size="-1">Country:</font></td> <td><input name="country" type="text" id="country"></td> </tr> <tr> <td> </td> <td><input type="submit" name="Submit" value="Send"></td> </tr> </table> </form> <div class="fgblue"><font size="-2">An email will be immediately sent to you <br> requesting your confirmation.</font></div> </div> <b class="spiffy"> <b class="spiffy5"></b> <b class="spiffy4"></b> <b class="spiffy3"></b> <b class="spiffy2"></b> </b> <b class="spiffy"><b class="spiffy1"></b></b> </div></td> </table></td> </tr> </table></td> </tr> </table> <br> <br> <div align="center"><br> </div> </div></div> </BODY> </HTML>